tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8785387207570374478.post2436408994451855429..comments2023-12-24T05:04:37.381-05:00Comments on The Train of Thought: SCOTUS Docket Watch – Juvenile Life SentencesJJhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02082265494052859780noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8785387207570374478.post-38113824392799905382009-11-16T12:11:58.782-05:002009-11-16T12:11:58.782-05:00@Nimsofa, just to clarify, the charge of Burglary ...@Nimsofa, just to clarify, the charge of Burglary with assault/battery is one charge separate from either burglary or assault/battery that is punishable <i>up to</i> life in Florida. Like the case here, that sentence is rarely given. Graham was given the life term for breaking parole with another felony home invasion charge while on probation, which according to the Florida penal code can mandate a life term w/out parole.<br /><br />But your point is valid; especially when you look at the Supreme Court's reasoning in Coker v. Georgia banning the Death Penalty for rape on an adult woman. Here the court laid out an objective proportionality construct through the 8th amendment's cruel and unusual punishment clause. Justice's also pushed for Retributive and deterrance arguments, much like Scalia and Alito in Graham/Sullivan.<br /><br />We gave this case to a high school group that I mentor as their project for the semester. Many of the same arguments are the same; some innate need to differnetiate between the specific crimes in each case. As soon as you bring up "Raping a 72 year old woman", the arguments change. <br /><br />@6.54;<br /> From Robert's recent statements, it seems like the court will strike some compromise (thus avoiding the central issue as they tend to do...) and push for a decision that will "take age into consideration".<br /><br />What do you think of the time gap for Sullivan? He was sentenced nearly 20 years ago, and has now spent the majority of his life in prison.Rbnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8785387207570374478.post-67323846126137834092009-11-16T11:22:20.716-05:002009-11-16T11:22:20.716-05:00so in the courts view assault and battery is the s...so in the courts view assault and battery is the same level of offense as rape? Maybe its just me but I feel like Sullivan's offense was far worse than Graham's. Sullivan's offense takes it to a level beyond criminal that is very perverse in my mind, although I was not the man getting beaten by a crowbar. Their ages aside I would think these offenses would have different sentences.nimsofahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15175804716702378601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8785387207570374478.post-54151000719331418732009-11-16T02:30:58.834-05:002009-11-16T02:30:58.834-05:00(The last sentence of paragraph 5 should read &quo...(The last sentence of paragraph 5 should read "In fact, I would argue for an age cutoff that's closer to <b>25</b> than 18.")6.54https://www.blogger.com/profile/16142293932150029874noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8785387207570374478.post-78800346607069671352009-11-16T02:28:49.394-05:002009-11-16T02:28:49.394-05:00Great feature! These are going to be fun (though m...Great feature! These are going to be fun (though maybe that's not quite the right word) to discuss. <br /><br />As for Graham/Sullivan, it <i>should</i> be a moot point: our parole system should be good enough to reliably pull out prisoners who are truly ready to live a crime-free life. We shouldn't need "life without the possibility of parole" category at all. Of course, that would require a prison system that has a greater than 5% chance of actually rehabilitating people, and greater faith in the ability of true psychopaths to get better. Still, it's a little sick to base a legal decision on the difficulty of rehabilitation. <br /><br />Ultimately I agree with Ginsberg, though I don't think her line of reasoning is the strongest. <br /><br />The notion of forcing someone to live in jail from the age of 13 until his death certainly strikes me as a contender for "cruel and unusual:" with the ages we're talking about it means an <i>entire</i> life in jail, not just the remainder of one. <br /><br />This horror of an entirely imprisoned life sets up the case for Graham and Sullivan's potential parole. What finishes it in my mind is the shifting nature of adolescent personality and understanding. How many grown-ups act the same way they did when they were 13 years old, particularly when it comes to issues of self-control and empathy? Aside from a few psychopaths, not very many. In fact, I would argue for an age cutoff that's closer to than 18.<br /><br />Though freeing people in their 30s with no adult experience of the outside world is a pretty scary thought, if they're really that fucked up then a psychiatric hospital, not a prison, is the place for them. <br /><br />That said:<br /><br /><a href="http://kondendiara.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">A friend of mine</a> does work with former child soldiers, nearly all of whom are suffering from a particularly complex form of PTSD. In most cases, they were kidnapped at a young age, severely abused, taught to revere their captors as all but gods, fed drugs and women and guns, and only then turned loose in war where they commit some of the most horrible atrocities on the planet. <br /><br />Despite the horror those children wreak, it would be hard to argue that they are fully culpable for their actions. Graham and Sullivan, at least from my limited knowledge, cannot rely on such a defense, at least not to that extent. Whatever their histories were like, they did what they did for themselves. And youth does not simply erase that culpability.6.54https://www.blogger.com/profile/16142293932150029874noreply@blogger.com